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Thread: GSP is either has no short term memory, or thinks that fans are retarded

  1. #111
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    I was open to a true conversation yet you claimed that Anderson is not a risk taker!

    Then you follow it up by explaining that because he's so good, it's not taking risks to have your hands down, dodging punches whilst doing a little dance (Forrest, Franklin)! Or trying flying knees vs Lutter, Marquart, Sonnen and Maia (all happened) or jumping switch kicks (Marquart), or repeatedly backing up against the fence and inviting your opponent to hit you?

    Sorry but what you're essentially saying is it's not risk taking because he can actually pull it off?!

    So hanging your chin out there for another man to hit whilst your hands are by your waist isn't risk taking? Forget who does it or that he's good at it!

    Seriously, I've honestly tried to have a serious conversation about this with you but I can't help but Lol @ your logic that because someone can pull something outrageous off, it therefore isn't risky?! How does he know he can pull it off? Serious question? Because to try something outrageous in it's sheer adacity is surely the epitomy of risk taking?

    Whether you are qualified to do so is another matter entirely and one that relates to your chances of pulling it off! But whether you pull it off or not has nothing to do with the initial risk taken!!!

    For Example:

    You DO NOT think this guy is taking risks:




    I mean, he's really good at what he does? So it is therefore not risky in the slightest!




    Look, all I'm asking is GSP take a few risks and open up on the ground. I'm not asking for capoiera kicks or summersault guard passes, I'm asking for a crushing/suffocating top game, nasty GnP elbows and relentless fishing for chokes!

    That isn't even really a huge risk for him is it? Or are you saying that he can't actually do that? Because applying your logic to it, you either think he's incapable of doing the above, hence it's such a huge risk, or you're applying different logic to GSP and Silva!
    Last edited by OliG83v.2; 01-29-2013 at 10:53 AM.

  2. #112
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    Come on my friend, don't make out that I've always said that I wanted to see GSP "stand and bang"! I've never said that, I've always said he should mix things up (I gave him big props for what he was doing vs Carlos for 2.5 rounds! THAT is what I wanna see from him!), and then beat the snot out of guys when he gets them down!

    As jasper says, I post 18x more about GSP than anyone else, so go back and find some posts where I say I want him to stand and bang?! It shouldn't be hard with so much material to search through, especially since I've apparently only just changed my stance on it in the last post but one?!

  3. #113
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by airjasper View Post
    This is the exact reason GSP is fighting Diaz (minus it being the tail end of his career), combined with his genuine dislike for the guy. He has stated it many times before that Diaz is the fight the fans want to see and Hendricks hasn't built his name up enough yet. But after being asked the same questions about Hendricks 400x he has added in the Koscheck deal as well and you just run with that.

    Very similar situations, yet you call GSP a duck and let Anderson slide.

    Well i'm gonna go enjoy my Friday night...Have a good one guys.
    Well the fact that it's the tail end of his career is a huge point (which funnily enough you gloss right over?! Hum...).

    GSP has another 8 years in the sport if he wants, Anderson? Maybe 2? Plus with his style he's built for the "got old overnight" scenario!

    Anderson wants a couple of lucrative paydays before he ends his career, so a tough, hungry Weidman doing 200k on PPV ain't a big pay day.

    Difference with GSP; and I know you'll say "Oh look, there is a difference!" rather than actually LOOKING at the difference! is 2 fold.

    1.) GSP is a monster draw regardless of who he faces! GSP - Diaz might do 800k, but be sure GSP - Hendricks is gonna do not a huge amount different! GSP is the draw!!!

    Anderson isn't neccessarily a huge draw on his own?! Don't let the Chael fights skew your perspective, he isn't doing 800k if he fights a guy with limited name value!

    2.) GSP still has a decent number of fights left, no?

  4. #114
    MMAWeekly Regular xxxVALETUDOxxx's Avatar
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    I disagree, Diaz/GSP is going to do a helluva lot more then Hendricks/GSP. They will have to pair the latter with some serious co main events. Diaz...say what you want about the guy, but people will tune in to watch him fight.

    Already at work everyone is talking up that fight...and most don't have a clue off name recognition who Hendricks is. There really is no comparison!
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  5. #115
    Member zakath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OliG83v.2 View Post
    2.) GSP still has a decent number of fights left, no?
    Maybe. I think it depends a LOT on how long that surgically repaired knee lasts. I think there's a plan in the works something like what Jasper detailed in a thread a month or so back where GSP fights a couple more fights at WW then leaves the division for superfights and $$$.

  6. #116
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxxVALETUDOxxx View Post
    I disagree, Diaz/GSP is going to do a helluva lot more then Hendricks/GSP. They will have to pair the latter with some serious co main events. Diaz...say what you want about the guy, but people will tune in to watch him fight.

    Already at work everyone is talking up that fight...and most don't have a clue off name recognition who Hendricks is. There really is no comparison!

    Ok, but you don't reckon the UFC hype machine could generate the buzz in a Hendricks fight? The Div 1 wrestler who happens to be a KO artist, etc, etc, legitimate test to GSP's reign, hardest guy he's ever fought, yadda, yadda, yadda?

    Well we should get a result from this in time, presuming GSP beat Diaz and Hendricks beats Ellenberger. We can see the PPV buy rates of the two GSP title fights and see just how many more Diaz will drag in. My guess is not a huge amount more.

    I've already said, the Diaz fight is being made because Diaz will get humped to 0-3 vs the WW wrestlers, so only way to make it is now coming off a controversial loss. (it wasn't, Condit out struck him and out thunk him! Stockton speak btw, not me being stupid!)

  7. #117
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zakath View Post
    Maybe. I think it depends a LOT on how long that surgically repaired knee lasts. I think there's a plan in the works something like what Jasper detailed in a thread a month or so back where GSP fights a couple more fights at WW then leaves the division for superfights and $$$.

    I'll eat a lightbulb if he ever leaves WW, or fights superfights (where he doesn't hold a significant size advantage)!

    He's gonna stay at WW for another 4 years or so, fighting progressively less stellar opposition (because Rory has already mangled the other guys) then eventually Rory will get pissed off and want what's owed and GSP will retire.

  8. #118
    MMAWeekly Regular airjasper's Avatar
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    Oli, could you please make a comment about how insanely tough GSP's opponents are to finish. Having a <4% finished rate in their last 104 fights would imply it takes something crazy to stop these guys, no? 2 of the stoppages were 1 punch ko's, 1 was Alves going for a dumb td leaving his neck exposed, and the other a giant knee from the clinch.

    GSP simply doesn't have the power to finish these guys. You say you just want him to take more risks...But those wouldn't lead to finishes judging by these guys history. You basically need 1 punch ko power to stop them.

    Like I said in my post, he definitely should have finished Hardy. He is not on the elite level like the other guys GSP has beat. But even in that fight, Hardy just proved the point of how tough he was...I still can't believe he didn't tap.

    Quote Originally Posted by airjasper View Post
    I'm bored, so here we go...Because what you have typed here is a giant misrepresentation of the reality of these guys toughness.


    Fitch: Stopped once in the last 10 years, 26 fights
    Shields: Stopped once in the last 13 years, 32 fights
    Alves: Stopped once in the last 6.5 years, 13 fight (and that stoppage was from him being a compete idiot giving Kampmann his neck)
    Koscheck: Stopped once in the last 6.5 years, 18 fights

    Lets throw Carlos in there too because he is part of the decision streak since winning the belt...

    Condit: Hasn't been stopped in the last 6.5 years, 15 fights.

    Hardy is the only dud on there, so i'll gladly give you that one. (Even Hardy has only been stopped twice in the last 7.5 years, 28 fights,, granted they came right after the GSP fight...And also the fact Hardy isn't anywhere near the level of the other fighters) But look at the other 5 guys on this decision run since becoming champion.

    Between those 5 guys, they have been stopped 4 times in their last combined 104 fights...< 4% finished rate........That's 100 other opponents who couldn't stop these guys either. And of those 4 finishes, 100% of them were "flash" ko's/subs. (Even both of Hardy's stoppages right after GSP's fight were also of that "flash" variety, where him and Carlos both swung for the fence and when he gave Lytle his neck...) And I'm saying "flash" finishes because they were all just quick and sudden out of nowhere. None of these guys were stopped by the way GSP stops people, which is a prolonged beat down until they are broken.



    Could he do more to stop these guys? Yes, but it would involve taking more than just the little risk a lot of you guys get at. He would have to take giant ones because these guys are as tough as they come. I don't think it can be denied that if you looked at all 5 of those fighters he decisioned individually people would have no problems with him not stopping the guy since it's so unbelievably rare that they actually are. Nobody cared when he didn't stop Fitch. Nobody cared that he didn't stop Alves. It wasn't until GSP didn't stop Hardy that people all of a sudden cared he didn't finish Jon and Thiago...Hell, nobody cared when GSP didn't stop Koscheck in their first fight...



    Yes i'm a giant nuthugger lol. But this is a much better representation of how tough Georges opponents have been than Jason simply saying "look at these guys getting stopped this 1 other time".
    Last edited by airjasper; 01-29-2013 at 03:13 PM.
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  9. #119
    Senior Member OliG83v.2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by airjasper View Post
    Oli, could you please make a comment about how insanely tough GSP's opponents are to finish.
    WTF?! Now you actually want me to comment on GSP related stuff?! Lol.

    Yeah they're all tough guys! What else do you want me to say?

  10. #120
    Senior Member Floyd1982's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OliG83v.2 View Post
    I was open to a true conversation yet you claimed that Anderson is not a risk taker!

    Then you follow it up by explaining that because he's so good, it's not taking risks to have your hands down, dodging punches whilst doing a little dance (Forrest, Franklin)! Or trying flying knees vs Lutter, Marquart, Sonnen and Maia (all happened) or jumping switch kicks (Marquart), or repeatedly backing up against the fence and inviting your opponent to hit you?

    Sorry but what you're essentially saying is it's not risk taking because he can actually pull it off?!

    So hanging your chin out there for another man to hit whilst your hands are by your waist isn't risk taking? Forget who does it or that he's good at it!

    Seriously, I've honestly tried to have a serious conversation about this with you but I can't help but Lol @ your logic that because someone can pull something outrageous off, it therefore isn't risky?! How does he know he can pull it off? Serious question? Because to try something outrageous in it's sheer adacity is surely the epitomy of risk taking?

    Whether you are qualified to do so is another matter entirely and one that relates to your chances of pulling it off! But whether you pull it off or not has nothing to do with the




    Look, all I'm asking is GSP take a few risks and open up on the ground. I'm not asking for capoiera kicks or summersault guard passes, I'm asking for a crushing/suffocating top game, nasty GnP elbows and relentless fishing for chokes!

    That isn't even really a huge risk for him is it? Or are you saying that he can't actually do that? Because applying your logic to it, you either think he's incapable of doing the above, hence it's such a huge risk, or you're applying different logic to GSP and Silva!
    I'm not saying and even clarified that I believe Anderson doesn't take risks. Getting in the cage and having somebody trying to punch you while you punch them is a risk. However, you claimed many times that GSP fights within himself and never opens up and takes risks. GSP does not Guida guys, he is active on top and just being in the guard of BJ Penn, Jake Shields, and Carlos Condit is a risk in and of itself. Posturing up, creating space, and then coming back with punches is a "risk" as well. It just so happens that GSP's skill set allows him dominating top control. He is fighting where his game is the strongest, he just doesn't have the GnP that Jon Jones does or the finishing capability of Anderson.

    Your argument is that he fights within himself which implies that you believe he just fights where he is comfortable and that equates to little risk. I applied that same logic to Anderson only using stand-up instead of top control b/c that is Anderson's strength. When Anderson faced Maia, the stand-up discrepancy was like when GSP faced Hardy on the ground. There was no real fear of Maia rocking Silva or Hardy subbing GSP. GSP passed guard, went to side control, had mount, and went for subs but he set it up first. That is the same thing Anderson does, he sets his guys up but uses more flash.

    Just because Anderson doesn't come in the ring with hands at cheek bone only throwing crisp 1, 2s and kicks doesnt mean he isn't fighting safely. Switch kicks are legitimate techniques, as are knees and flying knees, if there is an opening there is inherent risk but there is inherent risk in going for a TD and getting guillotined.

    It comes down to our interpretation of "risk-taking" and what that should involve: every punch you throw runs the risk of being countered, every TD you attempt is a risk in being stuffed/KO'd/Subbed, every sub attempt runs the risk of being reversed and losing position, every attack while grappling runs a risk of bring turned on you. Your argument is that GSP stays in a "comfort zone" where he has the greatest chance of winning while minimizing his possibility of losing AND I AM SAYING so does Silva. He fights where his strength is and if you want a very conservative definition of risk-takin then both guys are I you wanna liberal definition then neither guys are but somebody like Wanderlei would be, and our definitions fall further apart on the spectrum.

    Anderson does absolutely nothing that he thinks will not yield the highest, most efficient result and that includes elbows, flying knees, switch kicks etc. He does everything in his comfort zone, it just so happens he can KO people while in that zone.

    I for one enjoy Anderson's style of fighting more but I am able to take my hate goggles off when talking about other fighters. Why don't you just say you want GSP to be more aggressive? Hat would simplify our argument. If you did say that, I missed it.
    Last edited by Floyd1982; 01-29-2013 at 09:17 PM.
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