The Flu Sucks.

[rear naked mole rat]

To be fair, Vale witnessed a somewhat unique case and I can definitely see why he is skeptical of vaccines. I think they are overall much more beneficial but I can see Vale's point due to what happened with is dad and many veterans b/c of a mandatory government issued vaccine (in the military).

i agree with the sympathy. the situation he describes is tragic, full stop.

but, even taking his word for it that his father's death was directly due to a vaccine doesn't change anything. yeah, a very small number of people have reactions to some vaccines. some of those people may even die. that doesn't mean that vaccines aren't effective, it just means that nothing is perfect and not all people are exactly the same. it is a demonstrable fact that vaccines have saved far, far more people than they have harmed. taking a single situation and extrapolating it to the extent that one completely ignores all the very demonstrable good vaccines have, can and will do is dangerous and wrong. doing this sort of thing is exactly why there are children in rich countries dying of diseases like measles and whooping cough again. these diseases should be more or less wiped out in the developed world, but baseless paranoia has prevented that.

[xxxVALETUDOxxx]

i agree with the sympathy. the situation he describes is tragic, full stop.

but, even taking his word for it that his father's death was directly due to a vaccine doesn't change anything. yeah, a very small number of people have reactions to some vaccines. some of those people may even die. that doesn't mean that vaccines aren't effective, it just means that nothing is perfect and not all people are exactly the same. it is a demonstrable fact that vaccines have saved far, far more people than they have harmed. taking a single situation and extrapolating it to the extent that one completely ignores all the very demonstrable good vaccines have, can and will do is dangerous and wrong. doing this sort of thing is exactly why there are children in rich countries dying of diseases like measles and whooping cough again. these diseases should be more or less wiped out in the developed world, but baseless paranoia has prevented that.

Taking my word for it?

Why the hell would I lie, embellish or even push towards something like that? That's what my family was told. That's why he received the assistance that he did, on the gov't dime.

I wouldn't even begin to try and BS about something like that, that would be despicable.

The VA is expecting much, much more of this similar case to come their way. In fact, there is an entire room full of brand new respirators that are just waiting for the next batch to come through. It's sad man, literally the most real and most sad thing that I've ever witnessed in my life.

I've done my research, I could care less if I'm called crazy. I saw someone I loved dearly go down fighting the entire time and I've never felt so ****ing helpless to help someone in my life. Even typing this brings me to tears, it's something that is very painful...still. I don't think it will ever not be.

I volunteer to help the other MLS patients and it's sometimes unbearable and I should put in more time then I do....but man, words can't really describe it. I feel for the vets and I feel for their families. It's nothing that I wish upon my worst enemy, it's got to be up there in the worst ways to go out.

Sorry if I offended anyone in here, it wasnt my intent at the time, I really just got emo about it.

I'm starting to become a bit less skeptical about certain shots and I agree, they are needed. I just wish more funding and research was done and I wish that it wasn't such a money game.

[xxxVALETUDOxxx]

I have very little faith in our government but do have faith in medicine. the government doesn't create the flu shots, they subsidize companies that will produce them so the quantity is large enough to cover the population. I would dare say you have a better chance of dying from the flu than being seriously injured from the shot. I KNOW this to be a fact for vaccines such as polio, MMR, and pertussis.

Medicine isn't a perfect science but this seems like something an "alternatice medicine" healer would say and as the adage goes, there is no such thing as alternative medicine b/c if it works, it would just be "medicine."
With the flu shot, you are probably right, especially if you don't work in a crowded area or work with a bunch of sick people all of the time...

This is silly logic. Just b/c you do something a lot of people do, it doesn't make you "cattle" and even if it does, you have the "cattle" to thank for not getting sick with a lot of things, research "herd immunity." I don't like when people try to pretend they are more enlightened b/c some of the fringe research they have done may or may not showa correlation b/w vaccines and autism or other deleterious side effect.
That sucks man.... I know it does BUT if you compare the millions of people vaccines have saved vs the side effects of several thousand, even counting the anomaly vaccine that injures people, the benefits from the vaccine are just so much greater than the negatives.

I know since it happened to somebody you love and cherish, you may not see it that way and I can understand the sentiment but the logic doesn't work out.

It is all your immune system, the shot just helps it. I feel you on the flu but if you are elderly or very young, the flu can kill you and I have seen people between 30-55 that have died from it just this year.

I've seen Lou Gehrigs disease and it is awful but it didn't happen to my family. I can say with 100% certainty that even if it had happened like in your situation, I would still fully believe in vaccines b/c pound for pound, they have helped a thousand times more people than they have hurt...

This is foolish and you should take your own advice and do some research. You can't will yourself out of clinical depression just like you can't will yourself out of schizophrenia or cancer.

Nobody thinks medical doctors know everything, once you start learning, itis amazing to know there is so much we don't know. However, there are many things that medicine has done and it is amazing to think of what we will know 20 years from now. There will be mistakes along the way and I am not trying to say your dad's situation was a simple "mistake" but there are grave mistakes as well. Looking at good vs bad though, it is hard to argue that medicine doesn't help. I would ask you to talk to my mom who would be dead had it not been for medicine and the science, actually most everyone would have probably died by now had it not been for antibiotics, vaccines, and scientific breakthroughs.

This isn't helping your "I'm not crazy" cause...

So perhaps your immunity isn't as good as you thought if you are getting sick now that you are exposed to somebody in school? Just a thought.

This is something I'd rather just sit at opposite ends of a table and discuss, I feel that in type alot comes off in wrong ways.

[CaveBear]

HA, all this kinda reminds me, I THOUGHT i had an appointment with my Doc today, I called to cancel this morning because of all the snow we got. They THANKFULLY reminded me today is MLK day and that the entire VA is closed. I had no idea. My appointment is next Monday.....derf, derf....lol.